There is another thread in the Parent's Palooza section of this message board at http://www.gymchat.com/messageboards/viewtopic.php?t=24 regarding coaches' misconduct, sexual abuse, such as the WOGA case. There is more info. on the WOGA case out now and how a coach can manipulate his/her gymnast, on an article on the Gym Chat news page (this news page is good for checking on gymnastics news and updates by the way), called "Coach faces sexual abuse charges". The direct link to this article is http://www.planostar.com/articles/2006/09/17/plano_star-courier/news/news%2003.txt . It really all starts from the gymnast getting the understanding that they are just supposed to listen to the coach no matter what, trust them totally, .....i.e. be a robot or puppet....and then when the gymnast feels they are in a corner, they get threatened, and though they want to stop being that robot or puppet that just does what they're told and asks no questions, they then are so scared from all the threats and if they don't have that foundation of confidence and trust in themselves how can they stand up for themselves for sure? If a coach says Jump, you're supposed to say "How high"??? If you hear a coach say this, I say RUN! What kind of thinking is this?? Who ever said 'Why?' and 'What?' and 'How come?' are bad words?!! And, which gym should allow a coach to be in the gym with his student past hours until 10 pm or 12 midnight?! Or even to be in the gym alone with them at any time - this is not safe for many reasons - that's like in the top ten of Owning a Gymnastics Club 101.....this is where the club's liability comes in, as how could they not know this is what was happening. Liukin had his own champion daughter working out there - why wouldn't the parents think if Liukin's daughter isn't there at the gym during these late hours, isn't something wrong here? So, perhaps it is the parents that need to have a confidence and trust in themselves foundation as well and not just trust whatever the coach says. Perhaps the hope of what can be allows and feeds into this whole issue.

Update articles on the WOGA case are on the News page now; the coach from WOGA Christopher Wagoner pleads guilty to get a plea bargain and go to jail for 15 years. He has manipulated the 14 yr. old and her family, first by dropping her off to her home when the family needed help, then reducing the private lesson fee in exchange to making him dinner, doing family/friend stuff, massaging the girl while waiting for the dinner, to help in a back injury she got from gymnastics, so as to be 'nice' so the family wouldn't have to be pay for physical therapy....manipulation, gaining the family's trust.....really the method Oprah was talking about regarding the molesters and how they scheme to gain someone's trust and start slow, and then slowly progreess further and further past the line. Links to the articles are: "Ex-coach's sex assault trial opens (Dallas Morning News)": http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/DN-wagoner_19met.ART.North.Edition1.3ef81a6.html and "Coach pleads guilty to sexually abusing 14-year-old gymnast": http://www.kltv.com/global/story.asp?s=5428476

The TRULY good coach isn't going to LET a parent "kiss up" to get on their good side. We are going to expect the child to do the work and bring forth their drive to do it. If a gymnast truly wants the sport (not the parents), then the gymnast will "get r done." This coach abhores any "suck up" parents...I absolutely cannot stand the "OH, lets do a private lesson" groupy to 'suck up' to a coach. The true work happens in class - DURING NORMAL PRACTICE TIMES - not in special classes...or in staying after midnight or in inviting a coach to dinner! How did these parents come to the conclusion that an athlete staying until 10-12 midnight was NORMAL gymnastics training? To find a truly good coach is to know this and NOT fall into these "brown nose" tactics...A true coach will bring passion to the job, push the kids to their farthest but at the same time lift them up!

There are some parents that do private lessons at my gym to suck up to the coaches, and even take it further and bring lunch or breakfast, depending on the time of day, to them as well. One of the coaches in particular really likes it and responds to it, and keeps raising the private lesson rates too. There are a lot of these parents, so they will pay the extra money. Some even do privates with a few of the coaches, and the gym owners, for the politics. Those that do the privates for truly the right reasons and don't pick the coach based on politics actually seem to get treated differently by some of the coaches/gym owners, perhaps because they are sensitive as to why they were not chosen. The bad coaches treat the gymnasts in a different way when they know the parents are watching, the good treat the gymnasts the right way and the same whether or not the parents are there. So, if a gym does not allow parents to watch practices, it is an alarm. And it's good for the parents to check on the practices every now and then, and when the coaches don't know it too. Besides educating your child.

My daughter and I share this gymchat name. I agree with you Rollo...I am a coach and a single mother of an elite athlete. I refuse to coach her and I refuse to pay for private lessons. I trust our coaching staff to get the job done during class. They have done an excellent job! So has the National elite training staff! These instances that happen are very few. We need to just be aware...not overly cautious... Good coaches: They are passionate...it shows in their work during normal times... They do not require athletes or parents to do "extra" thngs like privates (unless there is a bonified reason...i.e., illness/injury causing athlete to be out of gym for a long time or a mental/emotional block that requires one on one work). They treat ALL athletes alike no matter who is on the podium... They do not spend personal time outside of normal gym functions with athletes... They do not buy athletes personal gifts or gadgets (Ipods,etc)...nor do they make scarves and such...unless they do it for the entire team! In a nutshell...use your common sense when choosing a coach. Do not fault the gym...fault the person who did the wrong...and be careful when choosing your gym...look around...and, by all means, be sure you are allowed to watch and observe. In most cases, if you look for a good gym, with a good reputation, you will find a good coaching staff that share the same principles as the gyms mission statement.

"They treat ALL athletes alike no matter who is on the podium..." A couple of coaches at my gym totally do no do this. And those coaches do not do this too: "They do not buy athletes personal gifts or gadgets (Ipods,etc)...nor do they make scarves and such...unless they do it for the entire team!" for their 'star' athletes. You should totally be allowed to watch practices!

We are a group of parents who want to speak to anyone who knows a gym coach called Sally Holmes from South Africa.We feel worried about the way she treats some of our girls.We have heard some rumours but would like some facts.Many thanks

Kayleigh, any news on that?

got some interesting information.can you help?

Does your gymnastics club have a parent group? If not, make one. In the USA the gym owners aren't supposed to be a part of the non-profit parent booster club and a part of their meetings, though I know of clubs that break that rule. You could complain as a group and get the coach out. If it's serious, you could report it to the governing gymnastics body in your region also, to ban them from coaching.